Britain's Contacts With Hezbollah Vex U.S.

News Type: Event — Seeded on Fri Mar 13, 2009 1:32 PM EDT

Article Source: The New York Times

world-news, israel, united-states, middle-east, palestine, lebanon, united-kingdom, hezbollah

... The United States, the official said, wanted Britain to explain "the difference between the political, social and military wings of Hezbollah because we don't see the difference between the integrated leadership that they see."

In its announcement, the British Foreign Office said it would take up "carefully selected" contacts with the political wing of Hezbollah but continue to shun the group's military wing.

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2.5

{"commentId":5919614,"authorDomain":"georgejean"}

georgejean

Can any part of Hezbollah be trusted?

{"commentId":5919614,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"georgejean"}

1 vote

#1 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 1:47 PM EDT

{"commentId":5920528,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

george:

No. Not in the slightest.

But since they are in the governing coalition in Lebanon, we don't have a choice but to treat with them. If we deal with the government of Lebanon, we're dealing with Hezbollah whether we like it or not.

{"commentId":5920528,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

3 votes

#1.1 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:28 PM EDT

{"commentId":5921697,"authorDomain":"Roybean"}

Judge-574295

What would you hope to achieve with contact with Hezbollah? There has to be something that justifies granting them status of equal diplomatic partner in Lebanon, in your mind.

{"commentId":5921697,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"Roybean"}

#2 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:21 PM EDT

{"commentId":5921843,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Judge:

I don't know. Do you think there's anything to be achieved with contact with the sovereign government of Lebanon?

Either Yes or No are perfectly reasonable responses, so I'm not picking a fight. It's just that if we have an embassy in Beiruit, which we do, we already are in contact with Hezbollah.

{"commentId":5921843,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

3 votes

#2.1 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:27 PM EDT

{"commentId":5922236,"authorDomain":"Roybean"}

Judge-574295

There might be consequences in further minimizing the government of Lebanon which are not offset by an unknown value in official channels with Hezbollah? And, to whatever degree one thinks that the US and Britian should be on the same page, the same question. What is gained by the contact?

{"commentId":5922236,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"Roybean"}

#2.2 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 3:47 PM EDT

{"commentId":5922744,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

You won;t know unless you try. Policies up to now have lead to nothing, maybe a try at a different approach may yield a positive result? Give diplomacy a chance?

{"commentId":5922744,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

4 votes

#2.3 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:10 PM EDT

{"commentId":5922862,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Judge:

You are drawing a distinction between "Hezbollah" and "the government of Lebanon" which does not in practice exist.

Let us say, for example, that the U.S.A. wanted to fly a mission over Iran from a Mediterranean-based carrier that required the overflight permission of the Lebanese government. Just a little reconnaissance, you understand. Do you doubt for an instant that Hezbollah wouldn't know about the request, and, in fact, effectively be in a position to veto it?

{"commentId":5922862,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

3 votes

#2.4 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:16 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923147,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

effectively be in a position to veto it?

something the US is very good at with the security council

fly a mission over Iran........Just a little reconnaissance, you understand.

yes, we do. And you expect Lebanon to give its blessings to more killing of Arab people?

{"commentId":5923147,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

2 votes

#2.5 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:28 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923283,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Maria:

And you expect Lebanon to give its blessings to more killing of Arab people?

Sheesh. It was a hypothetical. Any "reconnaissance" over Iran would probably be deployed from the Gulf anyway, and besides, Iranians aren't Arabs.

{"commentId":5923283,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

3 votes

#2.6 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:34 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923385,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

Iranian arabs were also hyppthetical :)

{"commentId":5923385,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

3 votes

#2.7 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:38 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923471,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Maria:

Great answer!

:^{)>

{"commentId":5923471,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

2 votes

#2.8 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:42 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923690,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

Just being "snappy" :)

Friday, national snappiness day!!

{"commentId":5923690,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

2 votes

#2.9 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:53 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923693,"authorDomain":"Roybean"}

Judge-574295

No, and we wouldn't ask for that, or communicate anything to the government that we did not want Hezcollah to know.

What I see here are two issues. One, the US being upset at Britian that the US did know know about the overtures. Then the US asking; What is the value?

Two, what IS the value? There is a limitation in advancing any policy in a discussion with the government of Lebanon, true. Is any policy enhanced by opening channels with two or three or four Lebanese factions, other than a policy that sees talking as an accomplishment in itself? Then, having three or four Lebanese factions independently talking to separate Western governments, separately. What is gained?

If Hezbollah was the entirety of the government of Lebanon, I might ask the same question. Now, they have the power to disrupt, but not enough power to enhance, leaving aside the question of any desire to enhance in a way that I would call enhancing.

{"commentId":5923693,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"Roybean"}

#2.10 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:53 PM EDT

{"commentId":5923862,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

However judge, Lebanon and Hezbollah have been very quiet and are coming to terms with each other. During the attack in Gaza, when rockets were fired from the border with Lebanon and hezbollah said it had nothing to do with it I was pleasantly surprised to read that Israel acknowledged that evem mentioning that despite their differences Hezbollah always took responsibility for its actions. So, why not give it a chance?

"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer" - the godfather (great movie by the way)

{"commentId":5923862,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

4 votes

#2.11 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:01 PM EDT

{"commentId":5924948,"authorDomain":"Roybean"}

Judge-574295

Maria, I haven't really gotten into why it might be a bad ideas, except for some prodding. Still looking for why its a good idea. It is apparently the question asked of Britian. Gillis agreeing, it is the question I ask of him. Surely there are some groups in the world for whom there is no bridge we want to build. The godfather admitted interests that coincided with his enemies. Then he was willing to wipe them out when there was not a half-way that he wanted to consider. What does Hexbollah bring that we find helpful?

{"commentId":5924948,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"Roybean"}

#2.12 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:59 PM EDT

{"commentId":5925041,"authorDomain":"palmasel"}

Maria-789794

I still support Britain for taking a different avenue based on failed policies of the past. As for the godfather, he "wipe them out" when they betrayed his trust or the agreements made. Watch the movie again.

{"commentId":5925041,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"palmasel"}

2 votes

#2.13 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:05 PM EDT

{"commentId":5925364,"authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

jfxgillis

Judge:

Still looking for why its a good idea. It is apparently the question asked of Britian.

I thought I made that clear.

A genuinely realistic American foreign policy that operated rigorously in the national interests has to be concerned with what's actually real.

And the reality is, we can't treat diplomatically with The Lebanon without dealing with Hezbollah. So no matter why Britain took the step, we should take it too.

If you're asking why Britain itself took the step, I bet it's a reward for Hezbollah's quite striking restraint during the recent Israeli campaign against Hamas in Gaza. While Hezbollah was up in Beirut in front of big crowds spouting all the expected anti-Israeli rhetoric, despite having military capability on the border with Israel, Hezbollah actually and on the ground (there's that "realistic" again) did absolutely nothing. 'Twas to laugh.

{"commentId":5925364,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"jfxgillis"}

3 votes

#2.14 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:24 PM EDT

{"commentId":5925399,"authorDomain":"Roybean"}

Judge-574295

Why watch a movie about a leader who is willing to find fault in others, subjectively, and then act to remove the problem? Go to the mattresses. Too painful.

Hezbollah doesn't even have any good music. If Britain doesn't have a toll booth in the script, the story ain't going anywhere.

: )

{"commentId":5925399,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"Roybean"}

1 vote

#2.15 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 6:26 PM EDT

{"commentId":5927093,"authorDomain":"greenpagan"}

greenpagan

Here's my take on the subject matter:

What the hell are we going to do, ignore Hezbullah forever?

(Or Hamas, for that matter. Are we ignoring Taliban...?)

====

{"commentId":5927093,"threadId":"526928","contentId":"2543361","authorDomain":"greenpagan"}

2 votes

#3 - Fri Mar 13, 2009 8:27 PM EDT

{"canLink":false,"threadId":"526928","isPrivate":false}

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